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 Post subject: Distortion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:04 am 
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I can't believe I'm making a "how do I make this..." thread, but damnit I can't figure out how to get this type of sound.

@ 1:25 -- the distorted, bright crackling kind of distortion that comes in on the kick(?), how would I achieve something to that effect?



I've been trying to accomplish this same type of noisey distortion for months and months using amp simulators, distortion plugins, and bitcrushers but I can never seem to get it perfectly.

:roll:

On this particular track, it seems like maybe he has a hi-hat playing on top of the kickdrum that's got some sort of processing on it to get that sound. I don't think that distorted noise is coming from the kick itself, right?

Any advice?

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:40 am 
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Here's another example.


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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:12 am 
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It's easy but probably not what your expected (hence why you made this topic!).

Simply add a distortion / saturation unit on a bus and send the kick and hihat (and whatever other sounds you wish to color) to it and blend the balance of the two in right.
This is the basic effect what happens when you let the kick (or whatever) be the sound that eats most energy from the distorted signal and crushes the other sounds along with it.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:20 am 
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It's on this older topic viewtopic.php?f=3&t=669&hilit=overdone&start=10 post by ozias_leduc he calls it "phantom distortion". His method removes the kick from the bus but leaves you with everything else distorted as if it was still there - which can be good because if you destroy the kick too much it will loose punch but this way u have the option to separate it.


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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:08 pm 
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YEah it`s just a distorted kick, with a hat running in to the effect as well.
Distortion is the same as compression in that the larger energy source will dominate the effect reaction, so the hats get crushed down when the kick is firing.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:31 pm 
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Ahh I knew there was a special trick to this...

"Phantom distortion"!!

Man I've been wanting gritty percussion on my tracks forever now but I could never get it to sound like this. I'm going to whore this technique out for the foreseeable future... ha!

Thanks guys.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:16 pm 
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Just tried it and this is a pretty cool tip. Obvious when you think about it, but I would never have tried it otherwise.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:54 am 
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Good stuff fellas. Got home and tried this out and all I can say is finally! I would've never figured this out on my own if I didn't have you guys to ask.

Subsekt FTW!! :twisted:

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:33 am 
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I haven't done this since that fxpansion remix comp (don't know why..), but I remember getting a nice variation on a repetitive loop by sending in a single kick running from a 2nd kick channel to duck the bus. Can't remember why I didn't just add the extra kick in on the original pattern.. probably just to keep the clean 4/4 goin.

Here's a Q for you guys that I was wondering but didn't ask: Is there a way of recording the affected version, . the kicks, both dirty and clean. Just wondering..

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 10:22 am 
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If you're using the "phantom thing" it can get a bit tricky if you start solo-ing the channels since the phase-invertion stops working. I guess you could set up a resample channel in Live and record from the master directly.


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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 3:38 pm 
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Love the effect I'm getting from this but can some one explain what is actually on. Phase inversion is something I cannot wrap my head around


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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:38 pm 
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if you do the same sound twice, but invert the phase of one of the two sounds,
both sounds will cancel each other out.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:42 pm 
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in other words : if you invert the phase of a waveform and put it on top of the original waveform (= play them at the exact same time), they will cancel each other outr, meaning you will hear nothing anymore.

you can do other things with this as well : you can take one waveform, and the exact inverted waveform, and put them on top of each other.
First you will hear nothing. Now start detuning one of the waveforms.
You will get a rather big sound instantly, because the effect of the beating oscillators gives it a lot of movement.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:44 pm 
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if you're interested, just a quick google :

http://www.indiana.edu/~emusic/acoustics/phase.htm

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:47 pm 
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or to put it even more simple : if you invert the phase of a waveform, you take the "mirror" of the waveform so to say.
whatever goes up now goes down, and whatever goes down now goes up.

really simple.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:54 pm 
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This thread is great. Missed this distortion technique first time round. I've always struggled to get this type of effect :D


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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:58 pm 
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@osha

and if you want to hear the sound of beating oscillators, just play a pure waveform on one note.
Please make sure there is no modulation whatsoever going on, just the raw waveform.
Now play another note at the same time, preferably not too far away from the original note.
Even though there's no movement programmed in your synth, you will still hear some movement.
That's because the waveforms of the two notes are "beating" against each other.
It's the same effect that you get when you detune your oscillators.
They constantly interact with each other, you might even say "disturb" each other, and that creates movement and gives you a much bigger sound.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 6:21 pm 
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Hades wrote:
@osha

and if you want to hear the sound of beating oscillators, just play a pure waveform on one note.
Please make sure there is no modulation whatsoever going on, just the raw waveform.
Now play another note at the same time, preferably not too far away from the original note.
Even though there's no movement programmed in your synth, you will still hear some movement.
That's because the waveforms of the two notes are "beating" against each other.
It's the same effect that you get when you detune your oscillators.
They constantly interact with each other, you might even say "disturb" each other, and that creates movement and gives you a much bigger sound.



You hear this on the odd DnB record- 2 sines played a key or 2 apart to make a wobble.

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 6:33 pm 
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Hades wrote:
you can take one waveform, and the exact inverted waveform, and put them on top of each other.
First you will hear nothing. Now start detuning one of the waveforms.
You will get a rather big sound instantly, because the effect of the beating oscillators gives it a lot of movement.


nice info. it could work pretty well with vocal and everything that usually need more body in a mix. i must try it :P

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 Post subject: Re: How would I go about getting distortion like this?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:19 pm 
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haven't tried it in Live itself, only on hardware synths. (too tired now to try, will check tomorrow)
but I presume if Live let's you completely invert the phase of any kind of waveform with the utility plugin,
then theoretically you could do this with any kind of waveform.
just put it in an audio track, invert the phase, rerecord, put them on top of one another and detune.
must be great fun for sure.

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