First hard synth ideas?

Punxsutawney Phil's Shadow _ Contains 'A Best Of..' Selection Of Frequently Discussed Topics From THE HOLE
Locked
User avatar
Hades
Shit Eater
Posts: 9795
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:02 am
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Hades »

Senko wrote:Currently it's between Polysix, Prophet 8, Waldorf Q and Waldorf XT (Racks). Expanded my budget just a bit more. But I thank you guys for all the feedback and recommendations :D
if I remember correctly from my days at vintagesynth, the polysix is notorious for it's battery leakage problem.
do a google on it and you'll find enough info.
bottom line : possible problem, beware before you buy, or check the original battery has been replaced.
Sin cambios no hay mariposa


innovine
hmmmmmm...
Posts: 372
Joined: Thu May 02, 2013 7:16 am
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by innovine »

Ok, fair point regarding the interface. I guess I was trying to express some frustration I have with mapping controllers to vsts.. it never seems complete, or entirely stable, as I tweak and change and remap it a bit all the time. This works against the muscle-memory and one function per knob ideals. Could well be a discipline issue on my part, but at least the hardware interface (good or bad) is as I remember it even if I don't use the synth for a few years. Can't say the same for vsts.

User avatar
oddmyth
Anba
Posts: 967
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:46 pm
Location: Toronto
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by oddmyth »

Yeah controllers aren't the best, agreed. However in terms of flexibility, customizing workflow and ease of change, the software layer with a controller can't be beat.

Sticking to customized layouts for VSTs on controllers is the problem. Most people don't map their VST's in any predictable manner, but its quite possible, to buy a couple of controllers and map out some synth parameters across them and use them for any number of synths. After all, most synths have a lot in common OSC/Filter/Amp/Amp Env/Filter Env etc. In this way you could create muscle memory across a number of VSTs. Same for step sequencers and samplers, you would only need a few unique pots for each different type of VST.
Cue 3 2013 - Devil's Advocate.

See what this is all about at oddmyth.ca

Planar
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 3883
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:05 pm
Location: Leeds
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Planar »

There are always solutions. With a suitable MIDI controller just map them once, stick to those mappings and make a cover for the controller. Make multiple covers for each synth or even dedicate the controller to one synth, a VST + dedicated controller is still going to cost less than hardware. Hell you can make your own midi controller easily enough with the exact layout you want.

Edit. What Oddmyth says.

User avatar
UN!T
Lifer
Posts: 741
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 4:40 am
Location: Send cash or fuck off
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by UN!T »

As far as controller go. One of the most useful items in my studio is actually my Novation Remote Zero. I bought it as a controller for my Waldorf MicroWave initially. Its fantastic for that. 6 pages of parameters to edit. Then I started using it with Ableton for volume faders. Now I am trying to integrate it as an extended control surface for my sequencer. I can flip back and forth through a few templates that I have for the MW,Ableton and the Cirklon and everything stays as it should and operates perfectly. None the less I still hate it ugly plastic crappy ass.

Laying out softies?
A couple years ago I create instrument definitions for every single Instrument in Ableton for my sequencer. I mapped every knob, button & fader control to the sequencer. I set up every one the same. Left to right across the face of it with all knobs in a module on the same page. If the module only had 5 parameters I would leave a blank space in the 6 slot to keep all the functions together that operate together. It took me 2 weeks a few hours a nite to get through all of them. Then I did an OS update and wiped them all in about 30 seconds with out backing them up. :cry: :lol: I haven't bothered with making them u again.
C0REZ wrote:techno 2014 = fascism
:lol:

User avatar
oddmyth
Anba
Posts: 967
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:46 pm
Location: Toronto
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by oddmyth »

Hades wrote: Though both are nice synths, they are completely blown out of the water by Omnisphere if you are looking for pads.
Well, Omnisphere can pretty much do everything very well, but it definitely excells in pads and textures.
I have no idea why no one here uses Omnisphere or ever talks about it, but it really is one fantastic synth.
Comes with well over 5000 presets, very well organised, and it's dead easy to make your own (though you'll mostly be blown away so much by the presets that you'll usually just tweak them more than start making sounds from scratch, and this is coming from a guy who usually doesn't like presets at all).
Omni has dual filters, 17 different filter types, highly flexible envelopes that can do great rhytymical stuff if you want. It can do waveshaping, ring modulation, basic FM, granular,... It has 6LFO's per patch,...
But really, all you gotta do is hear some of the patches.
If you're looking for atmospheric stuff, or just any kid of pads, whether they are airy, hollow, warm,... it doesn't matter. Omnisphere offers them all.
I know you've mentioned it on here quite a bit, just took a look, 1.5 looks really nice - I dig the iPad integration. It's really more of a virtual workstation than a synth, but you could get lost for years in that thing.
Cue 3 2013 - Devil's Advocate.

See what this is all about at oddmyth.ca

User avatar
Senko
decent
Posts: 331
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2013 3:45 pm
Location: US
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Senko »

Hades wrote:
Senko wrote:Currently it's between Polysix, Prophet 8, Waldorf Q and Waldorf XT (Racks). Expanded my budget just a bit more. But I thank you guys for all the feedback and recommendations :D
if I remember correctly from my days at vintagesynth, the polysix is notorious for it's battery leakage problem.
do a google on it and you'll find enough info.
bottom line : possible problem, beware before you buy, or check the original battery has been replaced.
Yes, they are truly notorious for the battery leakage and that leading up to a messed up board. But the sound, the SOUND!!! Heheh. They go for fairly cheap these days I see, but I'll make sure to look for one that's been serviced. Or I hope Korg follows with their spree and maybe remake the Mono/Poly or Polysix?

User avatar
Hades
Shit Eater
Posts: 9795
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:02 am
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Hades »

oddmyth wrote:
Hades wrote: Though both are nice synths, they are completely blown out of the water by Omnisphere if you are looking for pads.
Well, Omnisphere can pretty much do everything very well, but it definitely excells in pads and textures.
I have no idea why no one here uses Omnisphere or ever talks about it, but it really is one fantastic synth.
Comes with well over 5000 presets, very well organised, and it's dead easy to make your own (though you'll mostly be blown away so much by the presets that you'll usually just tweak them more than start making sounds from scratch, and this is coming from a guy who usually doesn't like presets at all).
Omni has dual filters, 17 different filter types, highly flexible envelopes that can do great rhytymical stuff if you want. It can do waveshaping, ring modulation, basic FM, granular,... It has 6LFO's per patch,...
But really, all you gotta do is hear some of the patches.
If you're looking for atmospheric stuff, or just any kid of pads, whether they are airy, hollow, warm,... it doesn't matter. Omnisphere offers them all.
I know you've mentioned it on here quite a bit, just took a look, 1.5 looks really nice - I dig the iPad integration. It's really more of a virtual workstation than a synth, but you could get lost for years in that thing.

you could, but you don't have to.
I had Atomsphere, the predecessor of Omnisphere, and that was already one great VST, but its wasn't a lot more than an excellent rompler.
Omnisphere is like 500x Atmosphere.
They've sampled pretty much every legendary synth, but they've also sampled so many original soundsources, a lot of times with contact mics, and then also ran all of that through all kinds of external gear.
Just have a look at their "sources" list, it's massive :

http://www.spectrasonics.net/products/o ... ources.php

You get 5000+ presets, but you have maybe 7000 or 8000 sound sources.

But with atmosphere you could only use your basic things like 2 LFO's, amp/filter/pitch envelope,...
Omnisphere gives you granular, FM, waveshapers, tons of filters, extremely flexible modulation envelopes (again with tons of presets), and tops it off with great FX.

Plus, and I guarantee you this : it's thé best sounding softsynth I ever heard, hands down.

So yes, absolutely, you could get lost in this, but you don't have to at all.
You can program your envelopes in the old fashioned ADSR style for example, or you could dive into the "advanced" page (or whatever they call it) and go mental.
But even on the more advanced pages, editing is still very very easy.
Editing one of those flexible envelopes in Omnisphere is like convincing a kid to eat a candybar compared to editing flexible envelopes with NI synths for example which is just a pain in the ass to do. :D

I work very fast with Omnisphere if I want to use it in a track.
Or I dive into all the sound design goodness if I just want to create some weird sound, and yes, then I can get lost for hours, but that's only cause I want to.
Sin cambios no hay mariposa


disparate
I forgot.... So baked.
Posts: 424
Joined: Mon May 14, 2012 12:48 pm
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by disparate »

Pretty tempted to get Omnisphere, have been for a while.

User avatar
Hades
Shit Eater
Posts: 9795
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:02 am
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Hades »

I think one of the biggest reasons why not more people are using it is cause it doesn't have a demo version.
This is cause it runs on a 100Gb library which you can't access at all (on huge closed folder), you can just install it and that's it.

But I guarantee you it's all worth it.
Omnisphere is very very very versatile, covers a huge sound palette, and is a superb instrument to work with.

If I could have only one single VST for the rest of my life, it's omnipshere, no doubt about that !
Sin cambios no hay mariposa


User avatar
ferramus
fancy woman
Posts: 46
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 11:10 pm
Location: Maassluis - NL
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by ferramus »

So I bought the arturia microbrute yesterday and played around with it for a bit, loving the sound.
Today, I connected it to my DAW about an hour ago for the first time, and I understand why everybody says hardware is better now. This is so much fun. To be clear, I've never used hardware synths before, this is mindblowing.

Only problem I have is that my pitch wheel doesn't seem to do anything, but eh. People seem to have worse problems with their microbrutes than me.

On the omnisphere discussion: I've been hearing about it for a while now, is it worth getting it? I've been doing nearly all my synthwork with sylenth and synplant, and it's been great, but I feel like there's better quality out there.
FL user - soundcloud: Ferramus

LaurentOrchard
pregnant
Posts: 211
Joined: Wed Sep 18, 2013 3:47 am
Location: Montreal
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by LaurentOrchard »

Tech Affair wrote:So I bought the arturia microbrute yesterday and played around with it for a bit, loving the sound.
Today, I connected it to my DAW about an hour ago for the first time, and I understand why everybody says hardware is better now. This is so much fun. To be clear, I've never used hardware synths before, this is mindblowing.

Only problem I have is that my pitch wheel doesn't seem to do anything, but eh. People seem to have worse problems with their microbrutes than me.

On the omnisphere discussion: I've been hearing about it for a while now, is it worth getting it? I've been doing nearly all my synthwork with sylenth and synplant, and it's been great, but I feel like there's better quality out there.

I'v been trying omnisphere. The sound sources are incredibly stellar good. The filters are alright. It can sometimes feel like a big rompler tough. I'm not very fond with the gui.

To me omnisphere feels like a big late 90s workstation synth like the korg triton.

I know it's powerfull, it's in there for sure but for some reason i can't develope a relationship with it. The price tag is high too.

I'd rather work with synth like sylenth. Download u-he's Diva demo if you have the chance. If only for the filters it's worth it.

I'v bought Madronalabs Aalto recently as well. Such wow. Very unique. Lots of fun.

disparate
I forgot.... So baked.
Posts: 424
Joined: Mon May 14, 2012 12:48 pm
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by disparate »

I tried Diva a while ago, sounds nice for sure. Not taken the plunge but I can see it would be pretty handy as a good-sounding plugin for "analogue" sounds with the benefits of a semi-modular (if that's the right term, being able to change the filters and stuff) soft synth.

And yes Omnisphere is very expensive, I'd need to suss out whether I'd get enough out of it to merit the price.

Love how we're talking about softsynths now ;)

User avatar
UN!T
Lifer
Posts: 741
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 4:40 am
Location: Send cash or fuck off
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by UN!T »

disparate wrote:I tried Diva a while ago, sounds nice for sure. Not taken the plunge but I can see it would be pretty handy as a good-sounding plugin for "analogue" sounds with the benefits of a semi-modular (if that's the right term, being able to change the filters and stuff) soft synth.

And yes Omnisphere is very expensive, I'd need to suss out whether I'd get enough out of it to merit the price.

Love how we're talking about softsynths now ;)
No that's not the correct term. Being able to change the filter setting is called a multimode filter. (i.e. you can change the filter from hi-pass to lo pass to band pass) A modular synth requires you to make all of the connections with patch cords to create the sound. Hence we call a sound a "patch". A semi-modular is a synth that has some patch points but the signal is already hard wired so you will still get a sound even if the patch cords are not connected. Once you start connect the patch cord you are rewiring the signal from its original path to a new one with the patch cords.
C0REZ wrote:techno 2014 = fascism
:lol:

LaurentOrchard
pregnant
Posts: 211
Joined: Wed Sep 18, 2013 3:47 am
Location: Montreal
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by LaurentOrchard »

UN!T wrote:
disparate wrote:I tried Diva a while ago, sounds nice for sure. Not taken the plunge but I can see it would be pretty handy as a good-sounding plugin for "analogue" sounds with the benefits of a semi-modular (if that's the right term, being able to change the filters and stuff) soft synth.

And yes Omnisphere is very expensive, I'd need to suss out whether I'd get enough out of it to merit the price.

Love how we're talking about softsynths now ;)
No that's not the correct term. Being able to change the filter setting is called a multimode filter. (i.e. you can change the filter from hi-pass to lo pass to band pass) A modular synth requires you to make all of the connections with patch cords to create the sound. Hence we call a sound a "patch". A semi-modular is a synth that has some patch points but the signal is already hard wired so you will still get a sound even if the patch cords are not connected. Once you start connect the patch cord you are rewiring the signal from its original path to a new one with the patch cords.

Bweh, nah, Diva has multiple module that you can swap around and all. But whatever. There is like 5 OSC module, 3 mixer module, about 4 filters ( with different modes and everything ) and a few envelope, but you cannot have a slot empty.

Dont bring your ableton in a box here! haha :lol: ;)

User avatar
UN!T
Lifer
Posts: 741
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 4:40 am
Location: Send cash or fuck off
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by UN!T »

LaurentOrchard wrote:
UN!T wrote:
disparate wrote:I tried Diva a while ago, sounds nice for sure. Not taken the plunge but I can see it would be pretty handy as a good-sounding plugin for "analogue" sounds with the benefits of a semi-modular (if that's the right term, being able to change the filters and stuff) soft synth.

And yes Omnisphere is very expensive, I'd need to suss out whether I'd get enough out of it to merit the price.

Love how we're talking about softsynths now ;)
No that's not the correct term. Being able to change the filter setting is called a multimode filter. (i.e. you can change the filter from hi-pass to lo pass to band pass) A modular synth requires you to make all of the connections with patch cords to create the sound. Hence we call a sound a "patch". A semi-modular is a synth that has some patch points but the signal is already hard wired so you will still get a sound even if the patch cords are not connected. Once you start connect the patch cord you are rewiring the signal from its original path to a new one with the patch cords.

Bweh, nah, Diva has multiple module that you can swap around and all. But whatever. There is like 5 OSC module, 3 mixer module, about 4 filters ( with different modes and everything ) and a few envelope, but you cannot have a slot empty.

Dont bring your ableton in a box here! haha :lol: ;)
:lol:

Oh I see. I have not actually looked at Diva before today. Its basically like a Virtual modular in that you select the modules but you are not required to make patch connection. That's kind of a cool idea. None the less I think the terminology is still applicable. :D
C0REZ wrote:techno 2014 = fascism
:lol:

User avatar
Hades
Shit Eater
Posts: 9795
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:02 am
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Hades »

LaurentOrchard wrote:
I'v been trying omnisphere. The sound sources are incredibly stellar good. The filters are alright. It can sometimes feel like a big rompler tough. I'm not very fond with the gui.

To me omnisphere feels like a big late 90s workstation synth like the korg triton.

I know it's powerfull, it's in there for sure but for some reason i can't develope a relationship with it. The price tag is high too.

I'd rather work with synth like sylenth. Download u-he's Diva demo if you have the chance. If only for the filters it's worth it.

I'v bought Madronalabs Aalto recently as well. Such wow. Very unique. Lots of fun.
The filters are better than allright. You have to remember there are many types of filters in there, plus not all these sound sources work well with some kind of filters.
Some of them work best with no filters at all but just some effects added.

Of course Omnisphere feels like a big rompler. It is a big rompler, except that it's like 50 romplers thrown into one,
plus they give you so much extra synthesis options on those sound sources.
You really can't compare it to a Korg Triton at all.
I have an XV-88 here as my main set of keys in the studio (almost never use it's synth engine any more). This used to be Rolands flagship rompler before they made the Fantom series.
Omnipshere is miles and miles above my XV88.

In a way, you're better of comparing it to a sampler with tons of fantastic samples thrown in there.
Of course, technically a rompler is nothing else than a sampler with a closed set of samples, but with most romplers like Tritons, Fantoms,... the samples are
1. made from famous synths
2. made from real life instruments

For Omnisphere they have used so many different sound sources, and so many different recording techniques, all to get as many different unique sound sources as possible,
and then they started creating many many more sound sources by manipulating all these sound sources in every possible way.
And you get all that on top of all the legendary sound sources and normal instruments that you get with normal romplers.
And with synthesis options you don't find on normal romplers like Triton, Fantom,...
And with a sound engine that sounds amazing.

The pricetag is absolutely not too expensive, not if you consider how much work and effort they put in there. Plus how much power you get in return.
Sin cambios no hay mariposa


User avatar
UN!T
Lifer
Posts: 741
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 4:40 am
Location: Send cash or fuck off
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by UN!T »

:D
Last edited by UN!T on Sat May 17, 2014 7:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
C0REZ wrote:techno 2014 = fascism
:lol:

User avatar
Hades
Shit Eater
Posts: 9795
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:02 am
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Hades »

Senko wrote:
These are my personal favorite and these are the sounds i'm going for.

youtu.be/Yo5A44qltmk
there's pretty much only one synth sound in there apart from the drums and that voice sample as far as I can tell,
and it's that pad chord, just a stypical pad with a filter sweep, perhaps tiny little bit of phaser.
But it's most likely a sample, at around 4:26 the chord changes pitch, and when that happens you can hear the typical "pitch" effect you hear when you play a sample a few keys lower or higher on the keyboard.
Sin cambios no hay mariposa


User avatar
Hades
Shit Eater
Posts: 9795
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:02 am
Re: First hard synth ideas?

Post by Hades »

Senko wrote:
youtu.be/fJlAXZgLdFs
this one was a lot more clever.
Only 2 real synth sounds : the short rhythmic "burst" lead sound. That's most likely probably a saw with the decay altered (and of course some other slight modulations, but not a lot)

The chord sound however...
At first I thought it was the filter opening up again in the release part of the sound.
After all it has negative filter modulation as far as I can tell.
I figured the chord was quite heavily side-chain compressed by kick/bass (is there even a bass there or is it just the kick ? hard to tell, only listened twice),
but then you wouldn't be hearing the sweepy release part.
And that sweepy release part comes from the same chord all right, at 5:44 you can hear it very clearly.
So I figure he probably used a different audio track that took the audio from the chord, and used a highpass filter and a delay and reverb. Most likely it's a ducking delay cause you can hear it take in the new audio input as soon as the chord strikes again instead of repeating the audio it already received.
And since that 2nd audio track isn't compressed, it can go nicely on without being influenced by the kick.
Plus it's high-passed anyway so it's never in the way of the low frequencies.

That's just my guessing after 2x listening.
I can be totally wrong.

Most important part for you : you can do this with anything : HW synths or VST's or a sampled chord, doesn't matter.
Sin cambios no hay mariposa



Locked