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Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:42 am
by Lost to the Void
Ok. So.
Sex, race, religion and sexual preference on all future demos please kids.
But we promise it's all about the music.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:25 am
by chava
The_G wrote:
Experiencing life differently = a different perspective. And yes, women generally experience life differently than men.
Yes. There are profound personality differences, something the feminists often deny, which is quite bizarre really. But of course there are just as profound overlap, something which is easily experienced in the (hard) techno scene where the women often are (act?) more masculine than many men, or me anyways. So what you get is in fact MORE masculinity as those women who make it big in techno are more masculine than men and what does this bring of diversity?

If people would go to the length of just thinking about what they mean by diversity, representation, masculinity/feminity etc this whole discussion would become clearer. This discussion applies of course to other creative fields as well.

I do in fact welcome more "feminity" within techno as it could perhaps "diversify" the dominant (masculine?) sounds, composition styles and general approach in aesthetics. But I can't really find some good examples.

Discrimination is another thing, and I am still of the impression that this is quite limited, especially in the off-mainstream/underground scenes. At least in Western Europe.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 1:29 pm
by Mono-xID
mainst09 wrote:Yall want to hear a true story?

One day i was approached by a girl whose artist name is "Ciel" but her real name is Cindy and basically she attacked because my artist name who for those who don't know its "Cindy" was already used, that my track titles were sexist and a lot of people in the scene were disgusted and all those things and you know what she did even before i could reply? she blocked me hahaha so she calls me the most stupid shit ever and then blocks me..
Can't see any stupid shit. Your track titles ARE sexist. So what's the point? That she blocked you before you could answer?
I'm interested in what you would have replied to her accusations.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:04 pm
by Prophän
Lost to the Void wrote:Ok. So.
Sex, race, religion and sexual preference on all future demos please kids.
But we promise it's all about the music.
No demo yet(I have a traktor mix tho), but i'm a black arabic trans-woman (i'm also gender fluid so may as well call me sir when I feel like it) and I love hard techno like richy howtin, are you interested ?
I'll give you a link to my mixcloud, ok ?

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:07 pm
by chava
RWise wrote: This mainly comes from the crowd that strongly follow R.A, mixmag etc - which are all heavy on the social-justice side of things.
Don't know about MixMag, but you are right on the money about RA.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:17 pm
by Lost to the Void
I got a review of one of my releases in RA recently.
My missus, who knows me so well, said "So how much do you hate yourself now? hipster sellout"

"Well, I did a little sick in my mouth when the label sent the news" was my reply.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:07 pm
by mainst09
Mono-xID wrote:
mainst09 wrote:Yall want to hear a true story?

One day i was approached by a girl whose artist name is "Ciel" but her real name is Cindy and basically she attacked because my artist name who for those who don't know its "Cindy" was already used, that my track titles were sexist and a lot of people in the scene were disgusted and all those things and you know what she did even before i could reply? she blocked me hahaha so she calls me the most stupid shit ever and then blocks me..
Can't see any stupid shit. Your track titles ARE sexist. So what's the point? That she blocked you before you could answer?
I'm interested in what you would have replied to her accusations.

lmao why are they sexist?

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:08 pm
by The_G
Lost to the Void wrote:Ok. So.
Sex, race, religion and sexual preference on all future demos please kids.
But we promise it's all about the music.
Not at all what I'm saying but okay. :)

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 8:02 pm
by 0dd
Wise man once say: We could save the world if we only stopped trying.
Just throw a good fucking party and if someone there says: "hey where are all the minorities? This party is politicaly incorrect"! Just tell 'em to fuck off and go rally round the white house! Stop ruining the vibe for everybody with your bullshit white knight act! And on that note: youtu.be/7W33HRc1A6c

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:28 pm
by Root
Now I'm worried about you.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:56 am
by meeb
The_G wrote:
Lost to the Void wrote:Ok. So.
Sex, race, religion and sexual preference on all future demos please kids.
But we promise it's all about the music.
Not at all what I'm saying but okay. :)
Well, I mean... you did say this:
For example, when there are more barriers for one group than another, then being "category-blind" is a way of just replicating the status quo.
So being "category blind" is bad because it perpetuates the status quo, but you should also at the same time not judge music by the person who made it.

Please do explain to me how those two sentiments don't completely contradict each other?

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:13 am
by meeb
As a follow-up that... Isn't basically all bigotry/racism/separatism/tribalism pretty much a direct result of people not willing to be "category blind" in the first place?

So the solution to the problem of people not being "category blind"... is to *not* be "category blind"?

Brilliant stuff, mate.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:17 am
by The_G
meeb wrote: Well, I mean... you did say this:
For example, when there are more barriers for one group than another, then being "category-blind" is a way of just replicating the status quo.
So being "category blind" is bad because it perpetuates the status quo, but you should also at the same time not judge music by the person who made it.

Please do explain to me how those two sentiments don't completely contradict each other?
It's a general comment about "category-blindness" as a moral ethical position, not a specific comment about music. If people in social category X face barriers that people in social category Y do not, then being "category-blind" can work to perpetuate the advantages held by category X over category Y.

The question, for me, is how to reconcile a belief in category blindness as an ideal with the reality of inequality. I don't like positive discrimination because it attacks the symptoms and not the root causes. In general, when there is inequality, I like policies that tackle the root causes of inequality, for example unequal access by race/ethnicity to quality schooling, chid care or health services.

Now keep in mind, we are still in general philosophy/politics territory here--not talking about techno, or even music. But let's talk about techno now. Say you have two DJs. One is make (X) and one is female (Y). If X > Y, and both are available for the same price, playing the same kind of music, then I'd say you book X--after all, X is better. And if X < Y, it's an easy decision for Y. But what if X = Y? In this case, I might book Y--especially if the night already tilts very male--because there are fewer women DJs out there, it's plausible that they face higher barriers than men in this scene, and I generally think the scene is healthier and more interesting when it brings together more diverse perspectives. Granted, there are reasons why I might still book X over Y--for example, if Y is a jerk and difficult to work with. But all things being equal, I'd strongly consider booking Y over X, for the simple reasons I laid out above: the more diverse the scene is, the less same-y and more interesting I find it to be.

Simple as.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:31 am
by The_G
meeb wrote:As a follow-up that... Isn't basically all bigotry/racism/separatism/tribalism pretty much a direct result of people not willing to be "category blind" in the first place?

So the solution to the problem of people not being "category blind"... is to *not* be "category blind"?

Brilliant stuff, mate.
Racism, for example, can be ideological (i.e. the belief that some "races" are better than others, or more deserving of privileges) or institutional (i.e. a system of inequality by race). Colorblindness is in fact opposed to ideological racism, which is why I believe in colorblindness as an ideal. But it can reproduce institutional racial inequality, because it tries to ignore how race structures inequality when it clearly does so. So for me, colorblind or category-blind societies are the ideal--something to work for. But, sadly, not the reality. Not even close.

Again, I'm speaking generally here. Not about techno. Frankly, I doubt techno has much of a racism problem, considering its roots. I think it's more plausible that techno has a sexism problem, but as I said above, I don't think it's the main reason why women become DJs/producers in small numbers than men. Could be wrong here, and I'd love to hear some female input to this conversation, but my suspicion is it's more a case of differing levels of interest in pursuing a career or serious hobby in this specific music style.

Re: Technoacts that are not white males

Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:33 am
by rabbit
intrusav wrote:Black lesbian bouncers maybe?
Ffs ..
intrusav wrote:An apple pie chart. Poor people?! No, you don't want poor people, or poor koalas either ..
intrusav wrote:They're racialist and will perv on your iguana ..
Lost to the Void wrote:Koalas are fucking stoners man. Totally unreliable.
juodas wrote:Why you don't paint your self then, if you can't find anything?
intrusav wrote:I heard a rumour...is Steve Rachmad a lesbian koala? Just that someone in the know let it slip. Such a lush piece of moozak. Yuss. Book him! ..

Just wanna thank you guys: THIS made my morning GREAT. Thanks!
Sorry for offtop.
:mrgreen: