The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Electronic Music Production // Dark Arts
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Prophän
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by Prophän »

Very interesting read here.

What I usually do to closed hihats is reverb with some added pre-delay, and changes in velocity, i also move some notes a tiny bit offgrid or slap a track delay as over9000 said :lol: , maybe even a little bit of delay (not more than 10% wet) if I'm feeling crazy.

However, I found out that's it's more dependant on the sound choice, as sometimes I find that the hi-hat i'm using fits quite nice even without too much processing. By the way I'm only using samples for my drums.

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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by intrusav »

over9000 wrote:...
how can you link the velocity with other parameters in ableton? tried with sampler, but dident find out how?
The most direct way with sampler is to click on the midi tab and go to the dropdown list beside the velocity listing.
Set Destination A as Volume and Destination B as Sample Offset.
Jack them up to 100 to hear the full effect (where you've got the velocity varying on several notes in the piano roll) and then ease them back to the level that works best.

There are other ways that might get you more interesting results like linking LFO 2 or 3 to sample offset with a slow rate and then linking the LFO amount on the midi tab page instead.

Play around with it, go crazy! ..

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Amøbe
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by Amøbe »

How much do you guys play around with the internal EQ of the reverb (I've only ever used Ableton's own reverb, so I'm just guessing that other reverbs are somewhat similar in regards of control). I find it hard to make great sounds with it (like a good hi-hat reverb) and I'm worried that I'm too touchy with the EQ!

And yes this is the most subsekt discussion I can come to think of :D

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Lag
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by Lag »

Amøbe wrote:How much do you guys play around with the internal EQ of the reverb (I've only ever used Ableton's own reverb, so I'm just guessing that other reverbs are somewhat similar in regards of control). I find it hard to make great sounds with it (like a good hi-hat reverb) and I'm worried that I'm too touchy with the EQ!

And yes this is the most subsekt discussion I can come to think of :D
Depending on the situation I pay special attention to EQing, damping, HF falloff and diffusion on very audible verbs on prominent devices. Helps clear out the room for the rest of the mix. I'd say that Nicholas Jaar is the god of clearing out reverb and still keeping it heavy and thick. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIrdTi7Bzt8
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Amøbe
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by Amøbe »

Lag wrote:
Amøbe wrote:How much do you guys play around with the internal EQ of the reverb (I've only ever used Ableton's own reverb, so I'm just guessing that other reverbs are somewhat similar in regards of control). I find it hard to make great sounds with it (like a good hi-hat reverb) and I'm worried that I'm too touchy with the EQ!

And yes this is the most subsekt discussion I can come to think of :D
Depending on the situation I pay special attention to EQing, damping, HF falloff and diffusion on very audible verbs on prominent devices. Helps clear out the room for the rest of the mix. I'd say that Nicholas Jaar is the god of clearing out reverb and still keeping it heavy and thick. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIrdTi7Bzt8
Homework! (had to look up what HF falloff meant...)

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Lost to the Void
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by Lost to the Void »

Amøbe wrote:How much do you guys play around with the internal EQ of the reverb (I've only ever used Ableton's own reverb, so I'm just guessing that other reverbs are somewhat similar in regards of control). I find it hard to make great sounds with it (like a good hi-hat reverb) and I'm worried that I'm too touchy with the EQ!

And yes this is the most subsekt discussion I can come to think of :D
Some people have trouble making the ableton reverb sound "good". I`m not sure why exactly.
It is a rather feature full reverb, a little like the good Lexicon units of old, so it can be overwhelming.

Anyway, I play around with the internal EQ as much as I need to, to get the required result.
Of course if you don`t really know what you are doing it becomes harder to get what you want.

Forgive me if this little guide comes across as patronising, it`s not meant to be so, I just thought I would break down the reverb a little.

Input processing - used to choose what is actually going through the reverb, so you can pull out lows, highs, whatever so the reverb takes it`s source from specific frequencies...
Most of the time, leaving this full range is fine.

Diffusion Network - It effects the reverb damping, but technicalities aside, it`s essentially an EQ.
For me it`s a very important control, great for making rumbling reverbs for your dark techno cliche kick drums, just roll off the highs.

Predelay simply delays the early reflections, used to create a greater send of space and the hardness of the space (and to give transients some room before getting swamped by the reverb).

Spin modulates the early reflections by amplitude and frequency. You can think of it as adding irregularities to the reflecting surfaces. Can be interesting at extreme settings.

Shape basically controls the distance between the main diffuse reverb and the early reflections. Essentially it can blend the two together. Useful when you want to make a reverb just a pure diffused tail with no detail, ala Big Reverby Berlin Style techno.

Density effectively adds more reflections.
Scale controls effect coarseness of the diffusion...but basically it`s a bright/dark knob..

Reflect and diffuse control the levels of the early and late (diffuse) reflections, respectively. Quite handy.

The chorus is essentially similar to the spin, but it acts on the diffuse (late) reflections.


Abletons reverb is actually very powerful, and it sounds great... any doubters go listen to Monolakes Ghosts, where most of the reverbs are ableton.

Get away from the presets and dive in.
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by dubdub »

As far as I know, Robert Henke actually coded the Ableon Reverb so if anyone should be able to make it sound good, it's him :)

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Amøbe
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by Amøbe »

Lost to the Void wrote:
Amøbe wrote:How much do you guys play around with the internal EQ of the reverb (I've only ever used Ableton's own reverb, so I'm just guessing that other reverbs are somewhat similar in regards of control). I find it hard to make great sounds with it (like a good hi-hat reverb) and I'm worried that I'm too touchy with the EQ!

And yes this is the most subsekt discussion I can come to think of :D
Some people have trouble making the ableton reverb sound "good". I`m not sure why exactly.
It is a rather feature full reverb, a little like the good Lexicon units of old, so it can be overwhelming.

Anyway, I play around with the internal EQ as much as I need to, to get the required result.
Of course if you don`t really know what you are doing it becomes harder to get what you want.

Forgive me if this little guide comes across as patronising, it`s not meant to be so, I just thought I would break down the reverb a little.

Input processing - used to choose what is actually going through the reverb, so you can pull out lows, highs, whatever so the reverb takes it`s source from specific frequencies...
Most of the time, leaving this full range is fine.

Diffusion Network - It effects the reverb damping, but technicalities aside, it`s essentially an EQ.
For me it`s a very important control, great for making rumbling reverbs for your dark techno cliche kick drums, just roll off the highs.

Predelay simply delays the early reflections, used to create a greater send of space and the hardness of the space (and to give transients some room before getting swamped by the reverb).

Spin modulates the early reflections by amplitude and frequency. You can think of it as adding irregularities to the reflecting surfaces. Can be interesting at extreme settings.

Shape basically controls the distance between the main diffuse reverb and the early reflections. Essentially it can blend the two together. Useful when you want to make a reverb just a pure diffused tail with no detail, ala Big Reverby Berlin Style techno.

Density effectively adds more reflections.
Scale controls effect coarseness of the diffusion...but basically it`s a bright/dark knob..

Reflect and diffuse control the levels of the early and late (diffuse) reflections, respectively. Quite handy.

The chorus is essentially similar to the spin, but it acts on the diffuse (late) reflections.


Abletons reverb is actually very powerful, and it sounds great... any doubters go listen to Monolakes Ghosts, where most of the reverbs are ableton.

Get away from the presets and dive in.
I by no means found this to be patronizing - I actually really needed somebody to break it down for me like this! Thanks a lot, you cunt <3

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Lost to the Void
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Re: The dark art of the perfect closed offbeat hihat

Post by Lost to the Void »

I might also add that the quality mode really effects the sound of the reverb quite a bit. Eco is fine for plate-like reverbs, but for big open stuff, transparent vocals etc you need Mid and High mode.
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