The Dark Techno cookbook

Electronic Music Production // Dark Arts
Post Reply
User avatar
ARiFF
snıuǝƃ ǝsɹǝʌǝɹ
Posts: 584
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 3:34 am
Location: ɯnıbןǝq
The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by ARiFF »

Hey guys,

i've been listening to techno and the darker side of techno for a long time now and lately decided to aim my productions more and more to that specific genre. Since im still learning, and try to gain as much knowledge as possible, i was wondering what you techno heads consider the basic ingredients for a dark techno track.

For me personally a perfect example of a Dark Techno track is the Bumload limited release of Nihad Tule & Bauri - Metal. I love the dark ambience the track is drenched in, the dry pounding kicks and the industrial feeling this one has. Slowly evolving and everything but repetetive.

youtu.be/pr0hodufCqk

The rolling (subs) together with the long reverbs are one of the main ingredients for a dark techno recipe.

I havent found much info or tips aimed specifically towards this "genre" and keep wondering if there's only a select few artists who know the key ingredient if that makes any sense. Meaning, ive been experimenting around with Reverbed kicks, LP filtered percussion, but the closest i reach towards the specific dark techno sound is nowhere close to what it "should" sound like. I know there's no magic formula or a "10 steps to create a banging dark techno track", but surely some techniques in sounddesign, sampling, drums, and so on would apply more to this genre than others.

Sure my reverbed kicks have a nice punch, but usually at the end of the evening i end up with a 4 bar loop, filled to the brim with deep basslines, but they always sound "flat" or too muddy afterwards...

Any ideas, tips & techniques from you guys would be much appreciated. Meanwhile i'll keep experimenting around and try to post my findings in here aswell ...

User avatar
ozias_leduc
ANAL
Posts: 918
Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 5:35 am
Location: melbourne, australia
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by ozias_leduc »

hmm. i don't think "dark" techno as you call it has any particularly different production techniques as compared to less darker tracks. it's more the intent and mood of the track.

in terms of content there's more of a leaning towards found sound. using a field recorder may help inspire you.

i would suggest forgetting the kick and bass for now and just focus on creating that industrial / dark environment, as it's the guts of the track. there's no point getting bogged down in whether your bass is wrong when you only have a 4 bar loop. get the song down first!

User avatar
Mattias
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 3413
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:19 pm
Location: Sweden
Contact:
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Mattias »

Experience.

You got the basics & you seem to know what you talk about, so I'd say it's all about the right mind set and then just keep on making tracks, all the way to the end even if they end up sucking. It's just incredibly effective to just keep making tracks, along the way you'll get more experience and solve problems an get ideas you never would've gotten by just sitting making some loops back and forth and constantly wonder why it doesn't sound "right". You're already in on this path so keep going.

Since I kind of operate in the "darker techno" area (according to most, not really according to myself!) I can probably answer some of your questions. I'm usually more effective at trying to answer then just tossing out random knowledge, sadly!
Music Page: http://www.facebook.com/Mattias.Fridell.Music
Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/fridell
Sample packs: http://mfsamples.bandcamp.com

Contention / 005

User avatar
Críoch
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 11025
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:22 pm
Location: Lego City
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Críoch »

I agree with the experience thing.. and the (lot of) practice thing. I've been trying to work out one particular thing for at least a year & only figured it out the other night haha. My problem was that I was making it too difficult & complicated. In the end it was stupidly simple.

Not that anyone here is doing it - but I hate on other forums when people say in a cunty way about "You just having to keep doing it". Its usually the way that it is being said that I disagree with, rather than the advice. Putting the word "Cookbook" in the title of the thread could definitely raise blood pressures haha :)

I know that we aint been going too long here.. but I think there is SO much information in "The Hole" - that you may be able to find many of the clues that you are looking for.

You might get some benefit too if you get involved with the sound design threads :)

Great track btw.. Hadnt heard it before.
KennethExack wrote:My kids and I are completely shocked by the specialized secrets that everyone has on this forum
>> Click here for NEW POSTS on subsekt <<

Dialog I The Hole I subsekt Blog I The Bench I IG I SC I Mixes I FB

User avatar
Wiu
Slowy J
Posts: 1316
Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 12:44 pm
Location: Horsham, UK
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Wiu »

ICN wrote:cunty
I love this word. Totally off topic I know. So I'm sorry for that!
Thank you for the laughs, debate, new music found, production tips etc etc over the years. I wish Subsekt and everyone all the best for the future. Wiu.

User avatar
Mattias
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 3413
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:19 pm
Location: Sweden
Contact:
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Mattias »

ICN wrote:
I know that we aint been going too long here.. but I think there is SO much information in "The Hole" - that you may be able to find many of the clues that you are looking for.

You might get some benefit too if you get involved with the sound design threads :)
And if it's not there already it will probably show up soon enough!
Music Page: http://www.facebook.com/Mattias.Fridell.Music
Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/fridell
Sample packs: http://mfsamples.bandcamp.com

Contention / 005

User avatar
ARiFF
snıuǝƃ ǝsɹǝʌǝɹ
Posts: 584
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 3:34 am
Location: ɯnıbןǝq
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by ARiFF »

Thx for the replies, i'm on a short weekend trip with my wife and the little ones, so i'll come back to this when we get back home. About the sounddesign threads i'm not sure how they work yet but if i can manage i'll be happy to join in.

Cheers guys back soon

User avatar
Lost to the Void
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 13518
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:31 pm
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Lost to the Void »

Well, dark techno used to mean techno with more experimental and industrial leanings, it now seems to be a word captured by everyone to encompass anything that doesn`t sound as twee and nice as Take That.
So if anything the cookbook for dark techno would be something like this.

"Take cookbook, burn cookbook, make interesting music"

I think stuff like the Bumload thing you posted is a little too cliche to really come under the dark techno banner, having a nice cliche white noise build for break etc. It`s just what used to be called Techno. Just techno.

This is just my opinion of course, but dark techno tends to be more edgy, more difficult disturbing, more out there, and, well, DARK

Such as
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1zw-4VYPag
or this absolute classic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMGAIBMy ... re=related
or this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzPKvnZR ... re=related
or this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dh8sV6RFin8
or even this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b28sgkcbbw (back before function put on his slippers and dressing gown before making techno)


So my main advice is experiment experiment experiment, and for darkness, find sounds that unhinge you, grate against your skin, make you uncomfortable.

Cavernous reverbs and oompah reverb kicks don`t cut it.
Mastering Engineer @ Black Monolith Studio
New Shit
Techno is dead. Long live Techno.

User avatar
NomadSpectrum
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 547
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:55 pm
Location: The Distant Void
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by NomadSpectrum »

Lost to the Void wrote:Well, dark techno used to mean techno with more experimental and industrial leanings, it now seems to be a word captured by everyone to encompass anything that doesn`t sound as twee and nice as Take That.
So if anything the cookbook for dark techno would be something like this.

"Take cookbook, burn cookbook, make interesting music"

.
Amen to that

Program
Chernobyl
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:47 pm
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Program »

As every1 already mentioned, you get best results with experimenting and doing stuff differently + it's a lot of fun to tweak stuff unlike doing something by the book.

For me, this is a perfect example of dark stuff. Actually anything from that label/circle of artists.

Porc - My Head Is Slowly Exploding (Ancient Methods Remix)

User avatar
ARiFF
snıuǝƃ ǝsɹǝʌǝɹ
Posts: 584
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 3:34 am
Location: ɯnıbןǝq
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by ARiFF »

Back home and really enjoyed reading all the replies. First of i'dd like to say that the topic title has been somewhat of a unlucky choice of me. I think i meant it to be used as an oxymoron, but i think the message got somewhat lost along the way. I didnt mean to offend anyone and i have to say i'm not looking for specific guides or recipes on howto make the perfect dark techno track. For me personally i need to create music to get rid of emotions, problems or whatever comes up in my head at that time, and thats one of the main reasons i like to do it. I can start with the idea of creating something uplifting, and eventually end up in a dark atmospheric track without the intention to do so.
get ideas you never would've gotten by just sitting making some loops back and forth and constantly wonder why it doesn't sound "right".
Recently i caught myself several times doing so, i easily get lost into loops because they dont exactly match what i had in my head. Maybe i should follow your advice Mattias, and when i get stuck inside trie to zoom out again and work more at the overall track itself... I dont know if anyone else has this problem and how they actually deal with it, i'dd love to hear though...
Since I kind of operate in the "darker techno" area (according to most, not really according to myself!)
To be honest the track in your signature is certainly something i would consider more into the "darker" regions of techno. Although i have to admit im not really fond of labelling or categorising music, but in this case i think it would fall under that "subgenre".

If i have more specific questions towards a certain issue or sound i might be having, i'll sure come pestering you about it Mattias ;)
Not that anyone here is doing it - but I hate on other forums when people say in a cunty way about "You just having to keep doing it". Its usually the way that it is being said that I disagree with, rather than the advice. Putting the word "Cookbook" in the title of the thread could definitely raise blood pressures haha
i agree too, but i certainly didnt take any replies in here in that way, i have to admit i was surprised about the extensive answers i got here. Once again, i think i might have found a new home on this board.

About reading up on "the Hole" forum categorie, i certainly agree, and i must say i have found some very decent information on stuff in there already. Still only arrived onto page 3 i think it was, so i have a lot more to readup on.
I think stuff like the Bumload thing you posted is a little too cliche to really come under the dark techno banner, having a nice cliche white noise build for break etc. It`s just what used to be called Techno. Just techno. This is just my opinion of course, but dark techno tends to be more edgy, more difficult disturbing, more out there, and, well, DARK
I hear you, but than again for me that specific track had a very dark and creepy atmosphere around it, but i think we both agree on the fact that this aint exact science and that it has a lot to do with how one perceives a specific track. Thanks for posting those samples aswell, i have given each of them a thorough listen.

Ive been reading your bio on soundcloud also and something in there attracted my attention. I hope you dont mind me quoting it in here, if you do lemme know and ill edit the post.
“I didn’t know what I was doing, it was my learning process. I was trying to combine all sorts of sounds, and somehow it worked for me
Sometimes i feel exactly the same and really feel like im still searching for my "own" sound. I seem to have found the majority of ingredients for that recipe, now to put them together to make it a cohesive part is something else...

So basically what i end up with reading through all the replies in here is that a specific sound is something thats gained through experimenting and experience. If i keep doing that, i should eventually end up with what i'm aiming for.

Sometimes, its not a bad thing that people remind you that the basic idea or technique you're using, is the correct way afterall. Now and than i tend to forget that, thanks for reminding me about it ;)

User avatar
Lost to the Void
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 13518
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:31 pm
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Lost to the Void »

Well there you go.
Don't be afraid to just play and experiment and do your own thing.
And most important..... Don't look at everything as something that needs to be finished (or released). Some, many, experiments, fail. But you are learning all the time.
It will be far more interesting and fulfilling to do your own thing and get somewhere with it than to just jump on an established sound and replicate it (something that happens all to often in techno now).

I still experiment all the time, and my success rate is, well maybe 1 out of every ten tunes gets to be a finished piece.
Mastering Engineer @ Black Monolith Studio
New Shit
Techno is dead. Long live Techno.

User avatar
Tobs
Pig
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:23 pm
Location: Lisboa
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Tobs »

Program wrote:As every1 already mentioned, you get best results with experimenting and doing stuff differently + it's a lot of fun to tweak stuff unlike doing something by the book.

For me, this is a perfect example of dark stuff. Actually anything from that label/circle of artists.

Porc - My Head Is Slowly Exploding (Ancient Methods Remix)
I'm new here but i can't help to say that THIS TRACK IS FUCKING AMAZING! lol I got here because i wanted to learn some new stuff and after listening to this track I'm like :o + :shock: + :mrgreen: + HELL YEAH
Honestly, i've just felt in love with the track, so brutal yet melodic somehow (don't ask why).

Anyways, if you want a cookbook for berghain/dark/whatever techno, it's basically reverb, delay, knowing how to Eq, at least technically. I can recommend you this:

pick/make/sample/whatever 8 sounds (you can pick more, but try to keep it a low number, and they should be really good sounds, never weak sounds);
program some good rhythms and stuff;
have 3 or 4 sends, being 2 of them delay and reverb and the other 2 something else (you can have another reverb, or chain some stuff and have your first reverb going through it and stuff, whatever you feel like);
map some stuff like the volume, pannings, sends, the decay of the high hats, or a filter of your "lead", whatever, to your midi controller;
do a dub mix. do a bunch of takes and pick the one you're happiest about.

i really like the uc-33 for this, it's perfect, but you can use whatever controller you have.

I'm taking my final exams now, but afterwards i'll try and do a tutorial on it. cheers and THANK YOU PROGRAM, YOU JUST OPENED MY POSSIBILITIES FOR LIFE eheheh

Edit: while programming, inject all the soul you can have on it, it's really important and that's what make the difference...
"needs more cowbell"

http://soundcloud.com/yassir

User avatar
Críoch
subsekt
subsekt
Posts: 11025
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:22 pm
Location: Lego City
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Críoch »

Tobs wrote:
Program wrote:
I'm new here but i can't help to say that THIS TRACK IS FUCKING AMAZING! lol I got here because i wanted to learn some new stuff and after listening to this track I'm like :o + :shock: + :mrgreen: + HELL YEAH
Honestly, i've just felt in love with the track, so brutal yet melodic somehow (don't ask why)...
Welcome Tobs! Great to see ya - feel free to introduce yourself here Mate

http://subsekt.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=23&p=6829#p6829
KennethExack wrote:My kids and I are completely shocked by the specialized secrets that everyone has on this forum
>> Click here for NEW POSTS on subsekt <<

Dialog I The Hole I subsekt Blog I The Bench I IG I SC I Mixes I FB

User avatar
Tobs
Pig
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:23 pm
Location: Lisboa
Re: The Dark Techno cookbook

Post by Tobs »

Done :) really liking it here, i've learned a lot just in 2 days of visiting the forum and the blog
"needs more cowbell"

http://soundcloud.com/yassir


Post Reply